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8 hours ago, purely fat said:

In no way am I saying it should necessarily be allowed in this thread but I will say this, poking the troll will only make it worse.

 

I also think design philosophy is something that should be allowed in a waywo because it should be a constantly evolving and developing stance. i.e. WAYWO

Would be nice if there was a thread where some of the more interesting thoughts could be moved to though. As you never know when something interesting might be discussed.

Regarding the first sentence I quoted here, I realized that was one of the possible outcomes.  I also thought it was not a likely outcome.  And even if that were the result, out of respect for everyone I prefer to assume the best possible scenario rather than avoiding bringing it up.  I feel it's worth addressing regardless of the outcome.

 

On the second part, absolutely!  If you or anyone else interpreted my post as me not wanting design philosophy discussed in this thread, then I did a crap job of explaining myself.  I WANT that type of discourse to happen here.  I just meant that it needs to be a discussion, as opposed to a monologue or series of one-off posts that are presented without the context that's necessary for discussion to take place.  It doesn't always need to be super serious, and I prefer that it not be.  But, there does need to be something of substance presented for it to really qualify as a discussion on design philosophy.

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18 hours ago, MultiLockOn said:

You should get into architecture design Nate. You'd be good at it. 

I'm sure I would. However It's not as interesting to me as pvp fps level design.
I find the added layer of logic function that comes with designing fps spaces to be much more intriguing and mind expanding. I also love not being bound to physical laws and limitations.

 

Real world architecture applications are too chore like...  Building material cost considerations, functional structural integrity considerations, along with having to design for realtively pre defined and  narrow goals make the whole process not as exciting and much more strenuous to me personally. 

 

Plus  architecture design is a very explored space all ready. I love how unexplored pvp level design is.  If you really think about it,  in it's infancy comparatively speaking! 

 

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6 hours ago, JB_ said:

This is prob the last progress pic I'll share for now.  I'll prob be back anyway for opinions on textures or other shit. But im just gonna try and finish it straight up. I get too caught up fixing small shit that isn't important.

 

those textures still aren't final on the two silos and silo cover. before you rip into it ICY! 😆 just wanted to share it anyway.

 

ANd the lighting is still last on my list of course. Map comes first, lighting last. I'm also migrating it to 4.26/4.27 and maybe unreal 5 when that gets more updates

 

 

 

 

Yooooo——-  I like the floor you got

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If infinite doesn't have like a UVMapping tool in Forge that's gonna be bullshit. the UV map modifier lets you mess with a texture on the fly.... double the texture value, or even lower it to get the right result. Say you only want one part of the texture. UV map would let you scale up/down the texture for the piece and move it around on said piece where you can apply it. You can even select faces, or wrap the entire object in the whole texture. (might not look good wrapped but you can)

 

dbbdb3dfc318be521d3e8b958b4d67bb.gif3c581218de14bd7bcc0cd55fcbc0c276.gif 

 

 

 

 

and I was thinking lately, they should be using some of the the old textures for forge, they work so good on low poly assets anyway. Not all textures would work granted but a few would be great. Any of the tiled texture from halo 3 would work, and there are a fucking lot of them almost 90% tiled/mirrored textures. for example this Panel Door Trim. I used to not understand why they didn't have more classic assets, but it's because the assets were built as part of the map. So giving us legacy textures is a much easier option.

 

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It's literally a flat texture/surface but it uses Bungie's parallax mapping to make it look like the center has depth to it. The only h5 forge piece I can think of that does this is the landscape pieces. They use the parrelax/displacement for the texture beneath them. This would be a nice thing to breakup maps with sick trims and sick walls or even let you use multiple different textures on the faces of the same forge piece.

 

Look how the room goes from low poly and flat to, not flat anymore.

 

5934ace00217266bce4d946cbc72acb5.gif

 

Which is another thing I've noticed. if it looks good untextured, it's just about figuring out the right textures for it. If a level/model looks good in gray box, it can look good lit and with textures. just about fooling around with them and getting the proper fit/feel. 

Edited by JB_
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We'll be hosting bi-weekly stream updates on the NextLevelDesign game over on the NLD Discord starting next Wednesday! We can get feedback from y'all about the direction the game is going, and I will have no excuse to not work on it! We're aiming for having the game fully playable by the middle of August and then having a public test in the winter after reworking things that, well, don't work. I'll start streaming on Sunday night if my second dose of the COVID-19 vaccine doesn't absolutely destroy me lol

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3 hours ago, Kantalope said:

We'll be hosting bi-weekly stream updates on the NextLevelDesign game over on the NLD Discord starting next Wednesday! We can get feedback from y'all about the direction the game is going, and I will have no excuse to not work on it! We're aiming for having the game fully playable by the middle of August and then having a public test in the winter after reworking things that, well, don't work. I'll start streaming on Sunday night if my second dose of the COVID-19 vaccine doesn't absolutely destroy me lol

The first stream will be about the sandbox, but hopefully movement can be discussed as well, just depends on if I can get crouch to work the way I want it to. There will be 6 weapons, 2 grenade types, and maybe some equipment along with control schemes. Just know that absolutely no art has been imported into the game, so it will just be about design

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lol I fucked up my project. I was trying to add the h3 animations like the arms and BR and i fucked up my first person blueprint. I tried replacing it with a first person blueprint from another project and idk. I can't test it but lmao.

 

It needs a reference to the player (you) for the grav lifts to work, but there is no player (you). you dont exist... Idk why but the first person model and camera arent there so.

 

I can still look at it. I really gotta move it to 4.26.2 now 

 

Nzsr86s.gif

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Thought of the day.  


In my opinion, not everyone's advice/feedback is of equal value. This applies to pretty much anything in life that feedback/advice/counsel etc can be given on.  So this got me thinking... 

 

 

What gives an individuals opinions/viewpoints on level design  value or worth? 

 

How do you guys as individuals evaluate and decide who has the authority to speak on what compromises a "good" level design versus a "bad" level design? 

 

 

Edited by SaltyKoalaBear
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Today's stream needs to be delayed until Monday. The current inventory mechanism is poor and cumbersome, and the new system will take at least a few hours to fully implement. The weapon_parent needs a massive amount of adjustments, too, after finding many issues that would hinder later development significantly if not addressed now. If I were to stream today, I wouldn't be able to share any in-engine work that has been done, and I have no other way of showing off the design as of now. It sucks, but these systems should be fixed before the following stream in two weeks' time.

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12 hours ago, SaltyKoalaBear said:

Thought of the day.  


In my opinion, not everyone's advice/feedback is of equal value. This applies to pretty much anything in life that feedback/advice/counsel etc can be given on.  So this got me thinking... 

 

 

What gives an individuals opinions/viewpoints on level design  value or worth? 

 

How do you guys as individuals evaluate and decide who has the authority to speak on what compromises a "good" level design versus a "bad" level design? 

 

 

I find the comments super interesting on that video, people seem to love chaos. One guy says that “balance” killed halo for him and he loves maps that are unfair, as it gives the team something to fight over. He proceeds to say if every spot on the map is easily countered it’s simply not fun for him. 
 

Now obviously to promote movement you need “imbalance” but I can relate with how this guy feels for what I personally enjoy in maps. 
 

Putting a giant tower at the bottom of high ground would “balance” the map while also stripping all the unique qualities and memorable moments and emotional feelings associated with that map. What would that map even be without the climb to the top? It’s no longer unique, it doesn’t matter if your team gets wiped at the top because you’ll just spawn on the bottom in a safe tower. The bottom would now have potential to be a viable strategy for the winning team as the team up top has to cross a wasteland downhill to still fight upwards to people in a tower. So while it may be “proportional” technically speaking to balance the map by putting a tower there I would no longer have interest in ever playing that map. 
 

This is the most exaggerated example I can think of atm of how this “balance” factor can ripple through different maps giving that lackluster feeling. 

 

Also let’s not forget how “hot spawns” and “snowballing” play into the pacing of slayer otherwise you have to increase the time limit to reach the kill limit 

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technically he’s right

     H5 maps are objectively good

          for ‘competitive’ H5 gameplay

               which is objectively bad for halo 

                    and human consumption


I think authority is conferred only upon those who have demonstrated their advice to be precise, workable, objective, etc., which does not require the person providing it to have any type of degree or checkmark next to their name. Badges or titles can help point you in the right direction, but are not necessarily the gold standard for determining authority.
 

Say someone has published 15 papers in neuroscience journals, has a PhD in neurochemistry,  but is in debt to the tune of 600k, lives with 15 cats, only eats peanut butter sandwiches - I’m not so sure that person could be looked to as an authority on anything other than brain chemistry. And even then, I’d steer clear, as those other characteristics are emblematic of some serious thinking problems...

 

The only metric I can think of for judging feedback is whether it serves the ends. That includes feedback about whether the ends are worth pursuing, or if the methods chosen are adviseable. Ex: Someone building a balloon to get to Mars in under 6 months might not like feedback that tells him it is futile, but if his goal is to get to Mars in under 6 months, it is good advice and should be heeded.


So this begs the questions: What kind of feedback? Pointing out a small problem? Suggesting an alternative, or a solution? Suggesting the project be scrapped? Is the person receiving feedback an authority on any related matter, or can they explain precisely why it was they did something a certain way? Do they have clear vision and purpose in the first place?

 

This reminds me of the feedback system 343 was showing off for their insider program. They had it set up so that ‘depending on what kind of gamer you are’ your feedback goes to different review teams. Unless those review teams are totally on the same page w/regards to the project’s goals, that means every team gets and acts on a totally different message, provided to them by a set of ‘!authorities!’ on some aspect of ‘!being a gamer!’, maybe enough to tear the project apart at the seams. 

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I haven't watched the video, but from a general standpoint I tend to view things similarly to what Box demonstrated above.  When taking in 'insights' from others in any form, my focus tends to be on what I can learn from it, rather than on the value of the individuals viewpoint.  Even if I think someone doesn't have a clue what they're talking about, something can be learned from their perspective. Very often there is value in the information even when I don't agree with the authors specific point of view.

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